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Does a free androgen index respond faster than the symptoms do?

Asked 10 Jan 2025Modified 15 months agoViewed 42k times
31

My laboratory results are from the same laboratory each time, drawn fasting, which I gather matters.

I would like help reading this properly rather than being told what conclusion to reach.

I have the full report including the method section, so I can quote specifics if that helps.

What can I legitimately conclude from this figure?

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askedDr_Aoife_Brennan20k2710 Jan 2025

5 Answers

Accepted answer first, then by votes
13

Accepted answer

The relevant detail is that the relevant mechanism is insulin resistance and its effect on ovarian androgen production, which is why a weight and insulin-sensitivity intervention has a plausible route to the reproductive phenotype.

Hirsutism and acne respond on the timescale of the hair growth cycle, which is months, so early absence of change says nothing.

Headline results, principal programmes

TrialAgentnDurationPrimary result
STEP 1Semaglutide 2.4 mg1,96168 wk−14.9 % vs −2.4 % weight
STEP 2Semaglutide 2.4 mg, T2DM1,21068 wk−9.6 % vs −3.4 % weight
SURMOUNT-1Tirzepatide 5/10/15 mg2,53972 wk−15 / −19 / −21 % weight
SURMOUNT-4Tirzepatide, withdrawal67088 wkContinued loss vs substantial regain
SELECTSemaglutide 2.4 mg17,604~40 moMACE HR 0.80 (0.72–0.90)
FLOWSemaglutide 1.0 mg, CKD3,533~3.4 yrRenal composite reduced; stopped early
SURMOUNT-OSATirzepatide, OSA46952 wkAHI reduced with and without PAP

Cycle regularity is a slow endpoint. Three to six months is the minimum window in which a change would be interpretable, and shorter studies are measuring noise.

The relationship between insulin resistance and ovarian androgen production is well characterised mechanistically and is the basis for insulin-sensitising approaches generally.

Nothing here is medical advice. Anyone of reproductive age has a contraception question here that a forum cannot answer.

Free androgen changes can come from the binding protein rather than from production. Read both numbers.

edited 11 Apr 2025 by valentina_rossi — expanded the table to cover the lower concentration

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VR
answered · acceptedvalentina_rossi9.7k1627 Mar 2025
The exclusion criteria are the most informative page in the supplement and nobody reads them. – Dr_Ravi_Selvarajah 7 months ago
2This should be linked from the help pages. – Dr_Rosalind_Achebe 8 months ago
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32

The short version: consistent improvement in metabolic markers, less consistent and less well studied effects on cycle regularity and androgen levels.

The Rotterdam criteria allow several combinations of the three diagnostic features, so a study enrolling on one combination reports on a different population from one enrolling on another.

Insulin resistance measured by HOMA-IR improves alongside weight in this class, and HOMA-IR is a fasting-sample surrogate rather than a clamp measurement — adequate for tracking, weak for comparing across studies.

Six months is the minimum honest window for a cycle-regularity claim.

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LF
answeredleah_ferrers12k1611 Jan 2025
5

Start with the phenotype. This is a heterogeneous diagnosis with distinct presentations, and evidence about one presentation does not transfer cleanly to another.

Restored ovulation is a fertility consideration in both directions, and any discussion of this class in a population of reproductive age has to acknowledge the contraception question rather than route around it.

Concretely, weight reduction of five to ten per cent has been associated in the older literature with restored ovulatory function in a meaningful fraction of people with this diagnosis, which is the mechanistic bridge the current interest rests on.

Guideline recommendations in this condition still put weight management and metformin ahead of newer agents, on evidence-base grounds rather than on mechanism.

The caveat is substantial: this is a diagnosis with reproductive, dermatological and metabolic dimensions, and it needs an actual clinician rather than a mechanism argument.

The mechanism is plausible; the direct evidence is thin. Both statements are true at once.

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CL
answeredcold_lane10k1618 Apr 2025
Same experience here, different supplier. – rota_site 1 months ago
The placebo-arm figure is the part everyone omits. – lyoph_cake 3 months ago
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3

Answering this properly needs to separate metabolic outcomes, reproductive outcomes and dermatological outcomes, which have different evidence bases and different timescales.

Free androgen index responds to sex-hormone-binding globulin, which itself rises as insulin resistance falls. So an androgen improvement can appear without any change in total testosterone production, purely through the binding protein.

Separate metabolic, reproductive and dermatological endpoints before reading any claim about this condition.

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VR
answeredvalentina_rossi9.7k167 Apr 2025
8Is the open-label extension included in that figure, or just the randomised phase? – RP_C18 5 months ago
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3

The honest answer is that there is good reason to expect benefit on the metabolic axis and thin direct evidence on the reproductive one.

Metformin remains the comparator with the longest evidence base in this condition, and any claim that a newer agent is superior needs a head-to-head trial rather than cross-study comparison.

Check which diagnostic criteria a study used before comparing it with another.

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DK
answeredDr_Sara_Kuusela28k3729 Apr 2025

Your answer

Ask PeptideStack is a static archive. Posting is closed, but the norms are worth stating: answer the question that was asked, show your working, cite the trial or the certificate, and say plainly where the evidence runs out.

Not medical advice. Research-use-only compounds are not approved for human use.