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Is 10 mg in 5 mL of 0.9% sodium chloride a sensible presentation for cagrilintide?

Asked 7 Apr 2024Modified 2.1 years agoViewed 39k times
13

Conditions: 10 mg · 5 mL · 0.9% sodium chloride · cagrilintide.

The failure mode I am trying to avoid is making this decision emotionally.

I have twelve months in view and I would like the plan to survive that long.

What should I decide now, and what should I defer?

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LM
askedlucia_marchetti19k277 Apr 2024
6Are you asking about the arithmetic or the technique? Both are answerable, separately. – forty_two_c 34 days ago
5Voting to keep this open — it is more specific than it first looks. – tandem_gradient 9 months ago
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5 Answers

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99

It gives 2 mg/mL, and whether that is sensible depends on the dose you will draw from it. 10 ÷ 5 = 2 mg/mL in 0.9% sodium chloride. A 0.5 mg dose is then 25 units on a U-100 barrel and a 1 mg dose is 50 units. Both land in a readable part of the barrel, which is the whole point of choosing the volume deliberately.

Start from the dose you intend to draw and work backwards to the volume that puts it in a readable part of the barrel.

For a dose that will change during titration, choose the volume for the largest intended dose rather than the first, so the whole schedule fits on one barrel without a mid-vial recalculation.

Concentration and unit conversion at a glance

VialDiluentConcentration0.25 mg0.5 mg1 mg2.5 mg
5 mg1 mL5 mg/mL5 u10 u20 u50 u
5 mg2 mL2.5 mg/mL10 u20 u40 u100 u
10 mg1 mL10 mg/mL2.5 u5 u10 u25 u
10 mg2 mL5 mg/mL5 u10 u20 u50 u
10 mg3 mL3.33 mg/mL7.5 u15 u30 u75 u

Units are U-100 insulin units, where 1 unit = 0.01 mL. Divide dose by concentration for millilitres, then multiply by 100.

Content matters. If the same 10 mg vial assays at 94 per cent content, you have 9.4 mg. In 2 mL that is 4.7 mg/mL, and a nominal 0.5 mg draw of 10 units actually delivers 0.47 mg — a six per cent shortfall that no amount of careful drawing will fix.

Insulin syringe barrel graduations are typically 1 unit on a 0.3 mL barrel, 1 unit on a 0.5 mL barrel and 2 units on a 1 mL barrel, which is why the barrel size changes what is readable.

A concentration calculated to three decimal places from a diluent volume measured to one is false precision.

Check the vial can physically hold the volume before you draw it up.

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OF
answeredorla_ferriter89k14812 May 2024
3Adding that a fixed-needle syringe loses about a tenth of what a luer one does. – lyoph_cake 5 months ago
2Minor: the filter membrane chemistry matters as much as the pore size for adsorption. – claudia_ferrante 3 months ago
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65

Total vial volume is a physical constraint: most 2 mL vials will not take 3 mL of anything.

Vial headspace is the hard constraint. A nominal 2 mL vial typically holds a little over 2 mL to the shoulder; adding 3 mL is not an option and attempting it wastes the lot.

Round to a diluent volume you can measure accurately. Measuring 1.00 mL on a 1 mL syringe is reliable; measuring 1.37 mL on anything is not, and the error propagates into every dose.

Do not change the diluent volume between vials of a titration without recalculating; it is the commonest source of a ten-fold error.

Choose the volume that puts your largest intended dose between 10 and 30 units. Everything else follows.

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answeredtenth_of_a_unit57k3724 May 2024
6Two of us worked through this independently and arrived here, so at least it reproduces. – h_villanueva 8 months ago
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49

Answer first: diluent volume sets concentration and therefore resolution on the syringe barrel, and resolution is free at reconstitution and impossible to recover afterwards.

Worked example. A 10 mg vial reconstituted with 2 mL gives 5 mg/mL. A 0.5 mg dose is 0.5 ÷ 5 = 0.1 mL, which on a U-100 syringe is 10 units. Reconstitute the same vial with 1 mL and the concentration doubles to 10 mg/mL, the same dose becomes 0.05 mL, and you are now reading 5 units instead of 10 — the same dose at half the resolution.

Write the concentration and the resulting units-per-dose on the vial label at reconstitution. The arithmetic that is obvious now will not be obvious at six in the morning three weeks from now.

U-100 means 100 units per millilitre by definition, so 1 unit is 0.01 mL and volume in millilitres times one hundred gives units. Every conversion here reduces to that.

Nothing here is medical advice, and research-use material is not approved for human use.

Write the concentration on the label at reconstitution, in units per dose.

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answeredg_paskevicius60k2720 Apr 2024
39

The short version: more diluent means a lower concentration, a larger volume per dose and a finer reading; less means the opposite.

The other direction: 10 mg in 3 mL is 3.33 mg/mL, and a 0.5 mg dose becomes 0.15 mL, or 15 units. More barrel, easier reading, and a larger fraction of the vial volume lost to dead space across the same number of draws.

Nominal vial volumes in the standard 2R and 3R glass sizes have published brimful capacities well above the nominal fill, but the usable volume is bounded by the stopper displacement.

Measure a volume you can actually measure. Round numbers, real syringes.

edited 22 May 2024 by ines_brandt — removed a claim I could not source

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IB
answeredines_brandt113k2571 May 2024
32

Answering this needs the syringe you actually own, because the barrel graduations decide what "readable" means.

Dead-space loss scales with the number of draws, not with the concentration, so a lower concentration spread over more draws loses proportionally less of the total peptide.

The caveat is that this arithmetic assumes the vial contains what the label says, and without a content assay it is precise about an unknown quantity.

Concentration equals content over volume, and content is not label claim.

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LC
answeredlyoph_cake78k26726 Jun 2024

Your answer

Ask PeptideStack is a static archive. Posting is closed, but the norms are worth stating: answer the question that was asked, show your working, cite the trial or the certificate, and say plainly where the evidence runs out.

Not medical advice. Research-use-only compounds are not approved for human use.