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Why did my HbA1c move after twelve weeks on dulaglutide?

Asked 5 Jun 2025Modified 10 months agoViewed 11k times
13

The case in front of me: HbA1c · twelve weeks · dulaglutide.

I have two candidate explanations and no way to distinguish them.

The same procedure has worked without incident several times previously, which argues against technique.

Is this recoverable, and how would I tell?

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MS
askedmarta_szymanska17k385 Jun 2025

2 Answers

Accepted answer first, then by votes
44

Accepted answer

The relevant detail is that the hazard ratio is the relative effect. What changes decisions is the absolute effect, and converting between them requires the event rate in the control arm, which is usually in the same table and rarely in the abstract.

A fasting lipid panel drawn during rapid weight loss reads oddly for a mechanical reason: mobilised adipose tissue delivers free fatty acids to the liver, and hepatic triglyceride export rises. Triglycerides can transiently increase while the person is doing exactly the right thing. Draw the panel when weight has been stable for a few weeks if you want an interpretable number.

Specifically, apoB and LDL-C disagree because they measure different things: LDL-C is the cholesterol mass carried in the LDL fraction, ApoB is a count of atherogenic particles. Small dense particles carry less cholesterol each, so a person with many small particles has a concordantly higher ApoB than their LDL-C suggests. When they disagree, ApoB is the better risk marker.

SURMOUNT-4 randomised participants after an open-label lead-in to continued tirzepatide or placebo, and the withdrawal arm regained a substantial proportion of the lost weight over the following year[1].

One qualification: a trial that demonstrates an endpoint at a given dose has demonstrated it at that dose. Extrapolating the endpoint down the dose ladder is an assumption, not a finding.

None of this replaces a clinician who can see the whole picture, and the whole picture is usually where the answer is.

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DT
answered · acceptedday_seven_trough11k1722 Sept 2025
4Have you seen anything published on this, or is it inference from the mechanism? – Dr_Hanne_Solberg 8 months ago
5Useful. I have added the accept threshold suggestion to my own notes. – tare_and_weigh 10 months ago
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16

This is a question about what the trial was designed to answer, and the honest response is that it was not designed to answer this.

The early fall in estimated glomerular filtration rate on treatment is haemodynamic rather than structural. Reduced intraglomerular pressure lowers the filtration rate acutely and preserves the glomerulus chronically — the same pattern seen with renin-angiotensin blockade and with SGLT2 inhibition. A dip of a few millilitres per minute in the first weeks, followed by a shallower long-term slope, is the desired trajectory, not a warning sign.

A network meta-analysis can rank agents that were never compared directly, but only under a transitivity assumption — that the trials being linked are similar enough in population, duration and endpoint definition for the indirect comparison to hold. In this field that assumption is often visibly violated, which is why indirect rankings should be read as hypotheses.

Read the confidence interval, read the estimand, and compute the absolute effect yourself. It takes two minutes and it changes how the result feels.

edited 8 Oct 2025 by tabular_nums — reworded for clarity after a comment

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TN
answeredtabular_nums47k383 Oct 2025
8Useful. I have added the accept threshold suggestion to my own notes. – vialroom 7 months ago
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Ask PeptideStack is a static archive. Posting is closed, but the norms are worth stating: answer the question that was asked, show your working, cite the trial or the certificate, and say plainly where the evidence runs out.

Not medical advice. Research-use-only compounds are not approved for human use.