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What did the placebo arm of FLOW report for constipation?

Asked 9 Jul 2024Modified 22 months agoViewed 24k times
21

What I am working with: FLOW · constipation.

This is presented as though it settles something, and I am not convinced it does.

I have two documents that appear to disagree, which is what prompted this.

What does this actually establish, and what does it not?

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askedsyringe_ninety12k179 Jul 2024

5 Answers

Accepted answer first, then by votes
10

Accepted answer

Answer first: read the primary endpoint, the comparator and the population before you read the effect size. Almost every argument on this site about a trial is really an argument about one of those three.

Confidence intervals matter more than point estimates when two trials disagree. Two studies reporting fifteen and twenty per cent whose intervals overlap heavily have not disagreed about anything.

To be exact about it, a composite endpoint is only as informative as its least serious component. Where a cardiovascular composite combines death, infarction and stroke, ask which component moved, because they are not interchangeable outcomes.

The cardiovascular outcome programme in this class runs to several large randomised trials — LEADER for liraglutide, SUSTAIN-6 and SELECT for semaglutide, REWIND for dulaglutide — and they are the reason the class is discussed as more than a weight intervention.

Be careful about generalising from a trial population to yourself. The exclusion criteria are usually the most informative page in the supplement.

Read the protocol and the statistical analysis plan if the result matters to you. Both are usually published alongside.

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answered · accepteddrawn_and_capped12k1722 Jul 2024
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35

This is answerable from the published record, but only if you take the placebo arm seriously rather than reading the active arm alone.

Intention-to-treat and per-protocol analyses answer different questions. ITT asks what happens if you offer the treatment; per-protocol asks what happens if it is taken as directed. The gap between the two is a measure of how tolerable the protocol was.

Put another way, duration decides what can be seen. A 68-week trial can measure weight and glycaemia; it cannot measure anything whose event rate is one per cent per year without enrolling tens of thousands.

One qualification: absence of a signal in a trial of this size is not evidence of absence for a rare event. It is evidence that the event is rarer than the trial could detect.

The short version: check the endpoint, check the comparator, check who was excluded, then look at the number.

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answeredDr_Tomas_Kral53k3816 Sept 2024
5

A trial establishes what happened to a defined group under a defined protocol. Extending it beyond that group is inference, and inference is allowed as long as it is labelled.

Trial populations are selected. Exclusion criteria in this class routinely remove people with significant renal impairment, prior pancreatitis and unstable psychiatric illness, which is exactly the population the results are then quoted for.

The part that matters: open-label extensions are not the same evidence as the randomised phase. Once everyone knows what they are taking, the reported outcomes acquire a bias that no analysis fully removes.

If a claim cannot be traced to a named trial with a named endpoint, treat it as a claim rather than as evidence.

edited 26 Aug 2024 by p_mkhize — removed a claim I could not source

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answeredp_mkhize58k2383 Aug 2024
4

Before comparing two trials, check whether they share an endpoint definition. Frequently they do not, and the numbers then are not comparable in any sense.

Non-inferiority and superiority designs are not interchangeable. A non-inferiority result says the new agent is not meaningfully worse against a pre-specified margin — it does not say it is as good, and it certainly does not say it is better.

The caveat is that trial evidence is about licensed product administered under supervision. None of it transfers automatically to research-grade material of unverified content.

Quote the interval alongside the estimate and half the disagreements on this site would not start.

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FU
answeredforty_units16k1714 Aug 2024
2Thank you for separating the surrogate from the outcome. That distinction gets lost constantly. – k_szabo 8 months ago
3The placebo-arm figure is the part everyone omits. – tobias_maartens 6 days ago
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4

The short version: the effect is real, the magnitude depends on the population, and the population is usually the part that gets dropped when a result is quoted second-hand.

Placebo arms in this class are not nothing. Lifestyle-intervention placebo arms in the major obesity trials commonly lose two to three per cent of body weight, so an active-arm figure quoted without its comparator overstates the drug effect by roughly that much.

Registry entries at ClinicalTrials.gov carry the pre-specified primary endpoint with a timestamp, which is the cheapest available check on whether an endpoint was changed after the data were seen.

When two sources disagree, the answer is almost always in the methods section of the one you have not read.

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DF
answeredDr_Colm_Fitzhenry69k24725 Aug 2024
The number needed to treat is the framing that finally made this concrete for me. – bufferline42 6 months ago
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Your answer

Ask PeptideStack is a static archive. Posting is closed, but the norms are worth stating: answer the question that was asked, show your working, cite the trial or the certificate, and say plainly where the evidence runs out.

Not medical advice. Research-use-only compounds are not approved for human use.